1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

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CSBM5
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1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by CSBM5 »

Of course this is "back in the day" :D A bit more E12 for the board. I took these pics at the Road Atlanta IMSA race in 1977. It was *very* rare to ever see 16" wheels back then.

Anyway, came across these in my huge stash of pictures from the 1970s IMSA races a while back, scanned them, so here they are. I also have a pic of an E12 from 1975/76 that was in the paddock with the Brumos group, but I need to get it scanned.

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Regards,
Chuck
Last edited by CSBM5 on Aug 16, 2016 8:24 PM, edited 1 time in total.
jdb
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by jdb »

Halter tops and Pirelli P7's!

Thanks for sharing, I have a few from back then also.
That E12 is sitting pretty nice.

Jeff
wkohler
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by wkohler »

Very cool. Thanks for sharing!
oldskool
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by oldskool »

Chris Motors license tag, bully E12 with a hottie and Farrah hair.
I'm in love.
wkohler
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by wkohler »

That looks like a '78 with the mirror mounted at the corner of the window but RHS mirror looks like <'77.
CSBM5
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by CSBM5 »

wkohler wrote:That looks like a '78 with the mirror mounted at the corner of the window but RHS mirror looks like <'77.
Good observation! It well could be a '78. I don't have anything to specifically date the picture, but I would have been at the Fall and Spring IMSA races at RA from ~'74 through '81 or so.

I'll have to get more of these old pics scanned as I typically photographed cars I liked in the car club corrals and such although I think this is the only one with a shapely hottie framed in the background...sorry oldskool...Farrah hair days were fun. I think Chris Motors tuned into Nalley somewhere through the years.

For those that remember the old Road Atlanta, these pics were taken on top of the hill overlooking the main straight, right next to the RA motocross track (hey, I do have a bunch of pics of pro motox from the era too, including some awesome close-ups of Roger DeCoster roosting his Suzuki up the main hill toward this location :)).
Adam W in MN
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by Adam W in MN »

Fantastic. The Motorsport pinstripe and wheels are really sharp, and thanks for the commentary on the 16" wheels of the era because I definitely wouldn't have known that. If you zoom in, it looks like the center caps in the wheels even have the original BMW Motorsport logo on them?

I wonder if you recreated the photo today, would the e12 or the woman look worse for wear? Rust vs sagging...
CSBM5
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by CSBM5 »

Adam W in MN wrote:Fantastic. The Motorsport pinstripe and wheels are really sharp, and thanks for the commentary on the 16" wheels of the era because I definitely wouldn't have known that. If you zoom in, it looks like the center caps in the wheels even have the original BMW Motorsport logo on them?

I wonder if you recreated the photo today, would the e12 or the woman look worse for wear? Rust vs sagging...
I think those are Epsilon 16" wheels which were very popular in the early days of " +2 " wheel fitments. Yeah, the transition to larger diameter wheels was very slow by today's standards. In 1976 the first turbo Carrera came with 15" wheels, and then in 1977 one of the big "ahhh" changes was 16" wheels (with 205/55, 225/50 P7s). The P7 was the only tire available in 16" sizes for a very long time, and since it was standard on the 930s, it was thought of as "THE TIRE" to have for ultimate street performance through the late 1970s. It literally took years for the low profile/larger diameter performance tire market to take off. It pretty much followed a typical S-curve adoption rate I guess. In 1977 a 16" P7 might be ~$200 which equates to ~$800 per tire today, so you can see why they were slow to take market share, and therefore rarely ever seen on a 530i like this one. In today's dollars, it might run $800/tire and $800 (or more) per wheel, so think of spending $6400 for a set of tires/wheels today.

By ~1980 or so, other European tires were available in 16" sizes like the Goodyear (European) NCT and Fulda that were creating price competition for the P7 along with testing better in performance tests. In fact, two often forgotten performance tires of the 1979-1980 timeframe had left the P7 behind performance-wise (in 13, 14, and 15" sizes): the Goodyear Wingfoot and the Phoenix Stahlflex 3011. Then right on their heels, Yokohama released the A001R which changed *everything* -- however still in 15" sizes and smaller but handily beating the 16" tires available in autocross/track performance.

It wasn't really until BF Goodrich released the first Comp T/A in 16" sizes (which seriously beat the P7 in performance now) in ~1982 that things started changing in 16" sizes. Then in 1984 came the Goodyear Gatorback. That was the tire I bought in Jan 1985 to swap out the 14" wheels on my Bavaria for 16s (8x16 with 225/50-16 all around). Later that year I switched them out for a tire few remember now: the Gatorback S. The S tire was molded with 5/32 tread and a sticky compound, and it was a blast on track, and essentially the 16" king of the track until Yokohama released the A008R.

So I guess I would say that 16" wheel "upgrades" did not become common until the mid-to-late 1980s. The 16" wheels on the Bavaria used to attract a lot of attention at club events in the 1985-86 timeframe.

Regards,
Chuck
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by GaAlpinaOwner »

Chuck so cool...would luv to see the mx shots...I was there as a kid....
wkohler
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by wkohler »

I had a couple of seconds, so I made your photos more visually appealing, maybe? Or something.

Image
Image
Image
CSBM5
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by CSBM5 »

Yeah, nice correction. That looks a lot better. I should fix all of these before posting them I guess. :oops:



Here's the 75 or 76 E12 from an earlier race that was parked right behind the Brumos pit setup. Again, not sure of the year I took this picture, but I think it was 1976.

Image
Adam W in MN
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by Adam W in MN »

These are fantastic, keep'em coming please! What a trick E12, more 16" wheels, the Motorsport stripe, it's an early hood bulge car, and that airdam looks pre-M535i, kind of like the South African 530MLE version. The MLE version I think was missing the large mesh grate openings that the later M535i version had.

http://www.firstfives.org/530MLE.html
CSBM5
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by CSBM5 »

Adam W in MN wrote:These are fantastic, keep'em coming please! What a trick E12, more 16" wheels, the Motorsport stripe, it's an early hood bulge car, and that airdam looks pre-M535i, kind of like the South African 530MLE version. The MLE version I think was missing the large mesh grate openings that the later M535i version had.

http://www.firstfives.org/530MLE.html
Pretty sure the car has Scheel seats in it too. I've never seen that particular front air dam for an E12 before or since.
wkohler
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by wkohler »

Those are pretty neat. Pretty sure they're a fiberglass replica of the MLE spoiler. I have seen a few of them and they're pretty cool but I couldn't do that spoiler on my Golf car. Looks good on Polaris though.
CSBM5
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by CSBM5 »

wkohler wrote:Those are pretty neat. Pretty sure they're a fiberglass replica of the MLE spoiler. I have seen a few of them and they're pretty cool but I couldn't do that spoiler on my Golf car. Looks good on Polaris though.
If you sell me the Golf car, I might could do the spoiler. ;) Actually, if you do sell it to me, I will. :)
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by wkohler »

:laugh:

Those wheels must have been very popular then. I'd figure I'd have seen more floating around though.
CSBM5
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by CSBM5 »

wkohler wrote::laugh:

Those wheels must have been very popular then. I'd figure I'd have seen more floating around though.

They were, but I don't think the quality was there, so perhaps that's why they've disappeared? A company called Mathis Marketing used to always advertise in the Roundel, etc, I seem to recall. These might not be Epsilon wheels too...I'm not sure.

Of course for some things, "quality" is in the eye of the beholder:

Image
m-racer
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by m-racer »

Thanks for posting. How cool is that. I remember admiring E12's when I had my first 2002tii. 2002's were expensive, a real stretch for me at the time, but the E12's - man they were way too serious for anyone I knew. Big time stuff.
wkohler
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by wkohler »

m-racer wrote:Thanks for posting. How cool is that. I remember admiring E12's when I had my first 2002tii. 2002's were expensive, a real stretch for me at the time, but the E12's - man they were way too serious for anyone I knew. Big time stuff.
Talk about a paradigm shift.

BTW, call me crazy but it almost looks like both cars are wearing BBS E50 magnesium centered wheels. I know there was an enkei or a Riken that was similar but those don't look like Epsilons.
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by bkbimmer »

CSBM5 wrote:
wkohler wrote::laugh:

Those wheels must have been very popular then. I'd figure I'd have seen more floating around though.

They were, but I don't think the quality was there, so perhaps that's why they've disappeared? A company called Mathis Marketing used to always advertise in the Roundel, etc, I seem to recall. These might not be Epsilon wheels too...I'm not sure.

Of course for some things, "quality" is in the eye of the beholder:

Image


I need a moment...
GaAlpinaOwner
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by GaAlpinaOwner »

Epsilon was the Sheet back in the day!

the rear valance on the White 530...were they always whacked looking on both drivers and passenger bottom rear corner side? I just noticed that.....
CSBM5
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by CSBM5 »

Chris will probably like this ad with the Golf E12. Has anyone seen this one before? I came across it in a program from Road Atlanta from the April 1976 IMSA race, likely the race where I took the picture of the silver E12 above behind the Brumos trailer.

Image

Regards,
Chuck
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by DC91 »

wkohler wrote:Those are pretty neat. Pretty sure they're a fiberglass replica of the MLE spoiler. I have seen a few of them and they're pretty cool but I couldn't do that spoiler on my Golf car. Looks good on Polaris though.
Hi , I just stumbled across this thread here.
The M- Spoiler pictured on the silver Car was not developed for the south african 530MLE, but was also used for the 530MLE.
That spoiler was available over BMW Motorsport GmbH from early 1976 on. Motorsport has made broschures in german and english language for the european market here, showing also the front and boodlid spoiler for the E12.
Those early spoilers had such a mesh in the air-intakes instead of the plastic-grid as we know it from the later E12 M535i. However also the version with the plastic grid came actually already before the official launch of the M535i in 04/1980.
It was offered from 1979 already for the pre- production M535i models.

However, it seems the spoiler was not availabe in 1974 and 1975 when BMW Motorsport has started to offer the "525-3.0 Motorsport" and the "525-3.0i Motorsport" (usally called in public just 530i Motorsport).
Having said that it was available from early 1976 on, makes it looking as it may have been introduced with the "533i Motorsport" conversion based on 525 and 528 models.

n.
CSBM5
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by CSBM5 »

DC91 wrote: May 01, 2020 1:00 PM
wkohler wrote:Those are pretty neat. Pretty sure they're a fiberglass replica of the MLE spoiler. I have seen a few of them and they're pretty cool but I couldn't do that spoiler on my Golf car. Looks good on Polaris though.
Hi , I just stumbled across this thread here.
The M- Spoiler pictured on the silver Car was not developed for the south african 530MLE, but was also used for the 530MLE.
That spoiler was available over BMW Motorsport GmbH from early 1976 on. Motorsport has made broschures in german and english language for the european market here, showing also the front and boodlid spoiler for the E12.
Those early spoilers had such a mesh in the air-intakes instead of the plastic-grid as we know it from the later E12 M535i. However also the version with the plastic grid came actually already before the official launch of the M535i in 04/1980.
It was offered from 1979 already for the pre- production M535i models.

However, it seems the spoiler was not availabe in 1974 and 1975 when BMW Motorsport has started to offer the "525-3.0 Motorsport" and the "525-3.0i Motorsport" (usally called in public just 530i Motorsport).
Having said that it was available from early 1976 on, makes it looking as it may have been introduced with the "533i Motorsport" conversion based on 525 and 528 models.

n.
Thanks for the details on the airdam/spoiler! As a good amount of time has passed since I scanned these pictures, I recall people there in the pits saying this was Peter Gregg's personal car (the silver E12 with the BMW Motorsport airdam). It makes sense too since if anyone had connections to BMW M it was him given he was driving the 3.0 CSL in IMSA at the time: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ueRNtODz-Q
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Re: 1977 E12 530i, less than 1k miles :)

Post by Mike W. »

Detail since it got bumped.

I believe the white car is a '78. I think the 530i trunk badge on black plastic was '78 only.
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