Turbo engine build!?!

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5timesturbo
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Joined: May 26, 2013 3:24 AM
Location: Fayetteville, Ga

Turbo engine build!?!

Post by 5timesturbo »

Well, I guess it’s my turn..... I wanna build a nice turbo capable engine to slap a TCD kit with air to water intercooler and go play. I’ve had the turbo kit and intercooler on the car for about a year running with the motronic system. I’ve decided to go to stage two. Decent built engine, stand alone and turbo system currently being ran on the car now. I’m not a baller like some of you guys on here so there is a limit to my fun. Anyway, I’m a believer in two heads are better than one. So I just wanted a bit of advice for the path. For example I’m planning on increasing the CR to 8.5:1. I don’t plan to do much of anything with the head because it’s a turbo application. However, I do wanna build the block up as reasonably as possible. Where can I get a performance oil pump?!? Things like that. Any advise if appreciated.
marc79euro645
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by marc79euro645 »

Bottom ends are typically good to go. I'd recommend stronger valve springs, HD rockers, arp head studs.
foolish
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by foolish »

What are your power goals and why not a B35?
5timesturbo
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by 5timesturbo »

My power goals are around 500. Looking at the dynos I think a m30 at 8.5:1 compression turbo pistons at around 18 to 20 psi and I should be at 500hp. I don’t want to do a b35 conversion because I think it’s overrated .....especially when The application is turbocharged.
tschultz
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by tschultz »

5timesturbo wrote: Aug 27, 2020 11:24 PM My power goals are around 500. Looking at the dynos I think a m30 at 8.5:1 compression turbo pistons at around 18 to 20 psi and I should be at 500hp. I don’t want to do a b35 conversion because I think it’s overrated .....especially when The application is turbocharged.
If you didn't know, the b35 head flows better so it will reach your goals more easily than b34 head.
5timesturbo
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by 5timesturbo »

The b35 does have bigger valves so it can flow more. I just feel with forced induction those things become less of a restriction. However, there is no replacement for displacement right?!? Also, I’m trying to keep my budget down and sourcing a b35 and all the drama seems like a corner I can cut and not loose too much from it. Hey
5timesturbo
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Joined: May 26, 2013 3:24 AM
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by 5timesturbo »

I want a good price on a performance oil pump.....can anyone point me in the right direction? Also, a complete gasket kit that covers all the gaskets on the front part of the engine. Help brothers.
marc79euro645
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by marc79euro645 »

I don't know of a hi volume pump, but I can tell you the stock pump will reach 125# plus when oil is cold. It's important not to rev too high, until motor is warm.
downforce22
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by downforce22 »

5timesturbo wrote: Aug 28, 2020 10:35 PM The b35 does have bigger valves so it can flow more. I just feel with forced induction those things become less of a restriction. However, there is no replacement for displacement right?!? Also, I’m trying to keep my budget down and sourcing a b35 and all the drama seems like a corner I can cut and not loose too much from it. Hey
the b35 doesn't have more displacement, it has higher compression and larger valves with the difference being the pistons and the head
mitch5
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by mitch5 »

If your on a budget then building a M30 with custom pistons is a waste of money for 500 hp, look up good & tight to see what is possible on a m30 with head studs. I also do not think a TCD kit will take you to those levels. I think the TCD kit is a tad below 400 hp.

I would spend your bucks on a standalone engine management system, megasquirt 2 is the most common. Trying to get 500hp tuned on the stock ecu would be much more work.

The advantage of the b35 is the higher comp, higher lift cam, dual valve springs and most importantly it has motronic 1.3 which will allow you run a standalone. Considering a complete healthy 3.5 can be found for less than $500, with a mls gasket($120) and arp studs($250) you will have a very capable engine for less than a grand.
Ken H.
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by Ken H. »

"budget" and "Turbo" (or "Forced Induction") is an inherently contradictory statement. Mitch5 is very much on point here. Even if the skilled labor involved is free, the outlays needed to do the job properly will make your teeth hurt. "budget turbo" is an oxymoron. :bawl:
5timesturbo
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by 5timesturbo »

downforce22 wrote: Sep 02, 2020 9:39 AM
5timesturbo wrote: Aug 28, 2020 10:35 PM The b35 does have bigger valves so it can flow more. I just feel with forced induction those things become less of a restriction. However, there is no replacement for displacement right?!? Also, I’m trying to keep my budget down and sourcing a b35 and all the drama seems like a corner I can cut and not loose too much from it. Hey
the b35 doesn't have more displacement, it has higher compression and larger valves with the difference being the pistons and the head
Thanks for the insight. I wasn't implying that the b34 had higher displacement. I was referring to when I have seen calculations on turbo engine hp/torq output number the calculations have only used engine displacement to consider CFMs and not how much CFM the head can move. Hence...no replacement for displacement..... I could be wrong though.....maybe some ppl calculate an engines capability using head flow numbers.
5timesturbo
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by 5timesturbo »

mitch5 wrote: Sep 02, 2020 5:45 PM If your on a budget then building a M30 with custom pistons is a waste of money for 500 hp, look up good & tight to see what is possible on a m30 with head studs. I also do not think a TCD kit will take you to those levels. I think the TCD kit is a tad below 400 hp.

I would spend your bucks on a standalone engine management system, megasquirt 2 is the most common. Trying to get 500hp tuned on the stock ecu would be much more work.

The advantage of the b35 is the higher comp, higher lift cam, dual valve springs and most importantly it has motronic 1.3 which will allow you run a standalone. Considering a complete healthy 3.5 can be found for less than $500, with a mls gasket($120) and arp studs($250) you will have a very capable engine for less than a grand.
Hey thanks for the info man. First let me say....I'm definitely going MS.I don't think it makes much sense to do all this and then be restricted by the FMS. SO, with all you said about a b35...I ask you to consider my logic and how I plan to go about this. I hope I'm right because I start scrapping the engine Sunday. I'm gonna replace the piston and rods with a turbo set of piston and rods that will put my CR at 8.5:1. The head will have performance springs and roker arms. Put together with metal headgasket and arp head studs. I gotta beleive that my engine would be much more capable than a stock b35. Also, all we I need to run a MS is the sensors needed for the MS system and the B35 crankwheel and sensor....
5timesturbo
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by 5timesturbo »

how long should the break in be? How many miles?
mitch5
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by mitch5 »

5timesturbo wrote: Sep 03, 2020 10:05 PM
mitch5 wrote: Sep 02, 2020 5:45 PM If your on a budget then building a M30 with custom pistons is a waste of money for 500 hp, look up good & tight to see what is possible on a m30 with head studs. I also do not think a TCD kit will take you to those levels. I think the TCD kit is a tad below 400 hp.

I would spend your bucks on a standalone engine management system, megasquirt 2 is the most common. Trying to get 500hp tuned on the stock ecu would be much more work.

The advantage of the b35 is the higher comp, higher lift cam, dual valve springs and most importantly it has motronic 1.3 which will allow you run a standalone. Considering a complete healthy 3.5 can be found for less than $500, with a mls gasket($120) and arp studs($250) you will have a very capable engine for less than a grand.
Hey thanks for the info man. First let me say....I'm definitely going MS.I don't think it makes much sense to do all this and then be restricted by the FMS. SO, with all you said about a b35...I ask you to consider my logic and how I plan to go about this. I hope I'm right because I start scrapping the engine Sunday. I'm gonna replace the piston and rods with a turbo set of piston and rods that will put my CR at 8.5:1. The head will have performance springs and roker arms. Put together with metal headgasket and arp head studs. I gotta beleive that my engine would be much more capable than a stock b35. Also, all we I need to run a MS is the sensors needed for the MS system and the B35 crankwheel and sensor....
My best advice is to not tear apart a good m30 shortblock period unless you are ready to have the whole thing machined for 3 grand.

Assuming you tear the b34 apart and find everything is in good order then I would highly recommend leaving the stock pistons in that block, the piston and cylinder wear together and having a 'seasoned' engine is actually an advantage since everything has worn together. Unless you are doing a full blueprint engine you are asking for trouble, Bmw assembled that engine with tolerances in the order of .0005 an inch. Slapping different pistons in without having the correct tools to measure is asking for trouble with tolerances. Now if you have alot of carbon buildup as a precaution you could take the b34 pistons out and rering them, then stone hone the block but i have never had a stock m30 pinch a ring under boost.

I would however get the head skimmed and given a nice surface finish, the mls gaskets are picky. In my opinion your money on a m30 turbo build is best spent on engine management, a welder(to make a flipped manifold y type manifold and downpipe/exhaust) and fuel injectors. You can run a $200 h35/hx40 turbo and make 500hp easily. All the other stuff will also nickle and dime you to death
5timesturbo
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Re: Turbo engine build!?!

Post by 5timesturbo »

Well. I hear your point.
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