Latest thoughts on e46?

General conversations about BMW E28s and the people who own them.
Kenny Blankenship
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by Kenny Blankenship »

gwb72tii wrote: Feb 02, 2022 6:23 PM buy a Subaru
Are head gaskets a maintenance item?
tn535i
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by tn535i »

My memory is coming back on some repairs...

A real annoyance on my son's e46 330ci and I guess common enough on e46's, is for the door latch mechanism, which also contains all the little microswitches, to act up. Expensive part and pain to replace. In the case of my son's car if the sun beat down on the dd the microwsitch activated, just like turning the key to unlock, and it would unlock the car, roll the windows down and open the sunroof. Not a great thing to find after having left your car parked outside overnight and it was starting to rain the next morning. There's a cheap fix though and who needs that feature anyway ? You unplug the door wire harness from the body and remove the wire from the connector on one side or the other, and then tape it up so it never gets that signal again. Now this assumes you can read the e46 schematics which compared to e28 are like 10x more complicated which is another thing I hate about the newer cars.

Couple more annoyances while we are at it...

They liked to change little things from time to time on random parts. Two versions of the same basic voltage regulator for example, some with one style and some another style connector. So you need to check things first especially electrical and in the case of the VR good luck finding the one style. Instead you pretty much need to replace the connector on the body side.

If you are lucky enough to have the HID headlights, which are pretty cool, just go ahead and be prepared to repair the little wires from the transformer and while you are at it disable the sensors that move the lights up and down since that is what causes the wires to fail. Or was it the little high beam shutter actuator ? Who knows, just another example of BMW getting so creative with features you never knew you needed or even knew you had until it quite working.
tn535i
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by tn535i »

Kenny Blankenship wrote: Feb 11, 2022 3:41 PM
gwb72tii wrote: Feb 02, 2022 6:23 PM buy a Subaru
Are head gaskets a maintenance item?
On some Subarus - a resounding yes. My son has an LGT and the turbo has upgraded MLS head gaskets which seemed to solve the problem.

I like the Suby AWD system better than BMW's and believe it works better but it's also not perfect or indestructible. The turbo cars are fun but everything rubber in the vicinity of the turbo is prone to issues from the heat. I need not get started on all the little issues with the Subaru you can find forums very active on that. However, we've both observed that BMW forums are much better about identifying problems and giving good PM advice while the Subaru crown is more of a 'run it till you break it' bunch.
Fedaykin528e
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by Fedaykin528e »

Jeez, not seeing many upsides to the e46. It's a shame, because I've always thought they were aging incredibly gracefully. This is a lot of great info regardless.
garageboy
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by garageboy »

If I could sum it up, the E30 and E28 are more "analog". You drive it and on a regular schedule, you replace some parts and restore it to the performance when new. Ownership is a constant cycle of maintenance.

The E39 and E46 are more "digital". You drive it and on a regular schedule, you replace some parts and restore it to the performance when new. But then other shit catastrophically fails along the way. Sensors. Coils. Electronic controllers. Coolant system components. Final stage resistor. Stuff that leaves you stranded.

If you maintain an E28 since new, it never leaves you stranded. If you are dealing with a 30-year-old E28 or E30 that has been maintained according to the spec its entire life, you can drive it cross country tomorrow. But the E39 or E46, as good as they are when everything is working, can become nightmares when items catastrophically fail. It's a different design philosophy. I love my original paint E39 manual, But after having my bumper covers repainted during the pandemic (something I never have to do with the E28), buying factory headlight fixtures to replace the original ($2000 versus $200 on the E28), my ABS controller died out of the blue last week. Apparently they do that. $1700 part.

Driving an E39 without ABS or DSC is not fun either. But the E28 is staying off the road until the salt is gone. If you find an E46 that has been taken care of, you'll enjoy it most of the time. But when stuff fails catastrophically... you'll begin to understand.
BMWCCA2
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by BMWCCA2 »

garageboy wrote: Feb 16, 2022 12:43 AMStuff that leaves you stranded.
Have you priced an E28 crank position sensor, brake bomb, or brake booster recently? Stuff that leaves you stranded!
offroadkarter
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by offroadkarter »

Fedaykin528e wrote: Feb 15, 2022 2:56 PM Jeez, not seeing many upsides to the e46. It's a shame, because I've always thought they were aging incredibly gracefully. This is a lot of great info regardless.

I currently daily drive a 01 330i and it has not given me any major shit. The key is to find a well maintained and looked after car, a lot of e46's these days are 9 owner salvage title "buy here - pay here" specials that nobody maintains.

Do you need AWD? The XI's are a bit more difficult to work on and have some specific parts to them (mostly the front suspension stuff). The xfer cases are completely reliable though (unlike the newer xdrive stuff which has commonly failing xfer cases). If you don't NEED AWD, I would get a RWD for sure, they're just nicer to drive and easier to work on. The XI's do hook and book in the snow though, I've driven a few XI's including a 5spd swapped 325XI touring.

I just did a bit of an overhaul on my car at 155k miles, the original radiator developed a small crack and was leaking so I decided to refresh a lot of things just for the sake of while I was in there. I also had a leaking oil filter housing gasket (common M54 problem) and a leaking oil pan gasket. Things got really bold when I came across a good deal on a 6spd ZHP coupe and took that opportunity to 6spd manual convert my auto sedan.

These cars (when in good shape) still feel new enough that you don't feel like you're driving such an old beater, the E46 platform in general has skyrocketed in price for clean cars as most of them are not in good shape anymore. They're nimble and fun to drive, still fast enough to keep up with modern traffic and get pretty good MPG (have his 28 highway with mine multiple times).

If you're interested in buying one, buy the nicest, lowest owner count, well maintained one you can find. Do not buy the cheapest one you can find then be surprised when some 20 year old part gives out.

PS: the cooling systems only "explode" when people overfill the reservoir tank, which causes the system to over-pressurize and blow out old weak tanks.
Mike W.
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by Mike W. »

offroadkarter wrote: Feb 16, 2022 11:45 AM

If you're interested in buying one, buy the nicest, lowest owner count, well maintained one you can find. Do not buy the cheapest one you can find then be surprised when some 20 year old part gives out.
After decades of commonly looking for the lowest entry point, I started doing the above about 10-15 years ago and it has turned out to be a brilliant strategy. The cheapest is the most expensive option. Ever more so with the complexity of modern cars.
garageboy
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by garageboy »

BMWCCA2 wrote: Feb 16, 2022 9:49 AM
garageboy wrote: Feb 16, 2022 12:43 AMStuff that leaves you stranded.
Have you priced an E28 crank position sensor, brake bomb, or brake booster recently? Stuff that leaves you stranded!
You obviously have more experience than most, but I have never seen a catastrophic failure of a brake bomb... I have only seen them deteriorate over time. And there are multiple options to replace it. Besides, my E28 doesn't have one. :rofl:

Point taken. My point is that the electronics in my E39 are so abundant, and so at-risk of catastrophic failure, that I will always prefer, and feel more confident in, my E28.

And yeah, I'm just pissed off because the E39 ABS controller I need is $1700... :(
Fedaykin528e
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by Fedaykin528e »

Well, I'm not shopping anymore. The transmission for the truck is a dud, bad input shaft bearing :brickwall: I'm going to pick up a 2nd used trans this weekend. It shall live to see another day.
BMWCCA2
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by BMWCCA2 »

garageboy wrote: Feb 16, 2022 3:15 PM My point is that the electronics in my E39 are so abundant, and so at-risk of catastrophic failure, that I will always prefer, and feel more confident in, my E28.

And yeah, I'm just pissed off because the E39 ABS controller I need is $1700... :(
In my experience (at the risk of being named a heretic on this site) the E34 is the best of all 5ers. If my '95 hadn't grown up in Ohio, I'd still be loving it today. As it is, it is sitting waiting for enough time and money from me to work on rust in the trunk and doors before enjoying it again. And that's after five E28s, an E12, and my current '02 530i Sport/Premium 5-speed manual with 80k that is hibernating in the garage right now. Tempted to BaT the E39 and spend the proceeds on the E34. :dunno:
BillW in StL
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by BillW in StL »

My GF had 2 e46 sport wagons, RWD automatic. I prefer my simpler e36s, but that is too old and not what you are seeking.

We looked at a Volvo wagon, and bought with no regrets so far.
Mike W.
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by Mike W. »

BMWCCA2 wrote: Feb 25, 2022 11:23 PM
In my experience (at the risk of being named a heretic on this site) the E34 is the best of all 5ers. If my '95 hadn't grown up in Ohio, I'd still be loving it today. As it is, it is sitting waiting for enough time and money from me to work on rust in the trunk and doors before enjoying it again. And that's after five E28s, an E12, and my current '02 530i Sport/Premium 5-speed manual with 80k that is hibernating in the garage right now. Tempted to BaT the E39 and spend the proceeds on the E34. :dunno:
Really? Never had an E34 although I've put well over 100K each on Es 12, 28 and 39. My perception, perhaps inaccurate, was that they were heavy, nearly as complicated as E39s, but less reliable. And to my eyes, styling hasn't aged as well as either E28s or E39s.
Adam W in MN
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by Adam W in MN »

My E34 M5 was one of the best cars I've ever owned. I still miss it.
BMWCCA2
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by BMWCCA2 »

Mike W. wrote: Feb 28, 2022 6:36 PMReally? Never had an E34 although I've put well over 100K each on Es 12, 28 and 39. My perception, perhaps inaccurate, was that they were heavy, nearly as complicated as E39s, but less reliable. And to my eyes, styling hasn't aged as well as either E28s or E39s.
My current (and only) E34 is a '95 5-speed Premium Deluxe with well-over 200,000 miles. I've driven many E28s, owned two 535i and three 535is and still have one of each today. My E39 experience was selling them new (also E28 and E34) and my wife drove a 528i to over 200k. My current garage queen is a 2002 530i stick Sport/premium with 80k of which I've put maybe 10k of those on it.

I know the E34 to be not less reliable than either the E28 or the W39, nor is it heavier (than the E39) or longer (than either the E28 or E39). Some day you may take back those remarks! :laugh:

Here's from a quick Google search. I included fuel-tank capacity because Curb Weight includes a full load of fuel:

1987 E28 535is 5-speed (US)
Length: 188.98 inches
Drag Coefficient 0.37 cd
Curb Weight 3,250 lbs.
Fuel Tank Capacity 16.6 gal

1995 E34 525i 5-speed
Length: 185.8 in.
Drag Coefficient 0.30 cd
Curb Weight 3,483 lbs.
Fuel Tank Capacity 21.1 gal

2002 E39 530i 5-speed
Length 188 in.
Curb Weight 3,494 lbs
Drag Coefficient 0.29 cd.
Fuel Tank Capacity 18.5 gal.

If you don't think the design has aged well, take a look at some good examples:

Image
bronziti
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by bronziti »

krhodes1 wrote: Feb 06, 2022 6:45 PM
I'm biased of course, having been the very, very happy owner of one of those ~450 RWD+6spd unicorn e91s in the US from new.
krhodes, n54 under the hood?

OP, i had the e46 touring MT for a while and it was great, but like mentioned its not that big in space if you're looking for it. once our second child came we upgraded to an e61 530 with the N52 engine, 2 child seats and enough space to fit junk in the trunk, one of the best road trip cars I've driven. but now like krhodes on an e91 rwd but an auto and not near half of his 450hp (wife needs to drive it as well)

e46 felt more grounded for me since i upgraded some suspension bits like poly rtab and lowered it with koni/eibach, i felt what each wheel was doing when driving around.
stuartinmn
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by stuartinmn »

I'm surprised the e34 is actually shorter than an e28, it looks bigger. I suspect some of that extra length on the e28 is due to the diving board bumpers on US spec cars.
LeiseyJr
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by LeiseyJr »

I have gotten an e46 330 6 speed with 160k for free recently due to it needing a steering rack binding on center). It has been somewhat maintained.

So far it has needed,
-water pump
- rad
- expansion tank
-top and bottom hoses
- new shocks
- power steering rack
- steering guibo
- power steering pump
- one power steering hose
- right headlight (projector bowl burnt out)

Gets fantastic mileage (compared to my e28), 6 speed is nice, a/c is okay, and the stereo is REALLY good (factory premium stereo).

Still on the todo list:
-diff bushing
-RTABS
-front rotors
- tires
- engine mounts
- left headlight

I like the car, but I can't imagine paying over 3k for one unless it is a very well maintained example. I have put 6000 miles on it or so since I got it in November. They are everywhere in junkyards which is great, 330s not so much but some 330 verts come in. I really like that aspect, ordering parts is fairly easy. They just need a lot. I don't think they are very well made, but the chassis is fantastic in terms of performance for what it is.

In contrast, my friend bought a 288k mile 528e. Car had experienced a lot of neglect in the past owners. We did the basic baseline of the car, I'd say a bare minimum baseline. His car has been turnkey, gets great mileage, a/c is good and hasn't skipped a beat.

Another friend we pulled a very neglected 528e out of someones driveway. That car didn't skip a beat as well got great mileage. Sold it due to title issues and trans cooler lines started leaking.

My point is, if you could get a nicely maintained 528e vs a well maintained e46 as a daily. I'd probably take a 528e. They aren't fast but stone dead reliable. The biggest con being how hard it is to replace one as well as ordering parts. Getting QUALITY non used parts is starting to become a real PITA to keep my e28 on the road. So in that respect the e46 is lovely and it is faster and more modern. It still is a fairly cheap bmw at the end of the day, so don't overpay.

Those are my scattered thoughts on e46s.
garageboy
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by garageboy »

LeiseyJr wrote: May 09, 2022 10:20 AM
My point is, if you could get a nicely maintained 528e vs a well maintained e46 as a daily. I'd probably take a 528e. They aren't fast but stone dead reliable. The biggest con being how hard it is to replace one as well as ordering parts. Getting QUALITY non used parts is starting to become a real PITA to keep my e28 on the road.
Ohhhhhhhhh, brother, I hear ya!!!

I never imagined we'd ever have this problem when I was driving E28s in the 1990s and 2000s. I thought with BMW Mobile Tradition, so much competition, and with 3D printers, we'd be having an easier time getting parts, not harder. It's more than a PITA. One wastes time, money, and it's a soul-sucker.
turbodan
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by turbodan »

I spent a decade with the e34/e46/e39. They have their advantages but I came back to the e28 for several reasons.

The M54 is a great engine but the last few I've owned had gremlins. Bad ignition coil in the e39 but no check engine light despite the intermittent misfire when tipping into the throttle. Same gripe I had with the e46. Didn't run right, no codes stored. DME thinks everything is great. When I got the car it had the air boot halfway off of the idle control valve. Huge vacuum leak. No check engine light. Go figure on that one, they are notoriously sensitive to air leaks. Makes troubleshooting a real bitch when you have these obvious issues that the DME doesn't see.

The e28 lacks a serious AC, the parts supply isn't what it used to be, I can deal with all that. I have had more fun and less problems driving e28's than any of the later models, despite all of the advanced technology.
Fedaykin528e
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by Fedaykin528e »

Well, 2nd transmission for the truck was also bad - super fun. But, thread closed, we picked up a 2001 325xi Touring automatic. I'm glad it's a preface lift, and checks all the other boxes:

Image

Image

Image

It has 260k miles on it but is in pretty good shape considering. From the records it's had a bunch of the maintenance and issues mentioned above addressed in the past. It needs a bit of work to be 100% but it feels like a good value. It was offered by a neighbor I've come to know who has the exact same e28 as me, mine's closest to the house. He's a nice guy!

Image

Thanks all for the tips, experiences. I'll try to post back here with updates.
Last edited by Fedaykin528e on Jun 13, 2022 6:52 PM, edited 2 times in total.
John in VA
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by John in VA »

Now hunt down some sport seats - they make a huge difference.
Panici
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by Panici »

Ooo a touring! Nice buy.
Probably my favorite E46 (besides the M3 with CSL kit in Laguna Seca Blue).
Fedaykin528e
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by Fedaykin528e »

So far pretty good! Known or emerging issues are a slight flutter/misfire on light throttle on the highway, variable steering near center, and a broken rear spring. The VANOS itself hasn’t been touched in 260k, but no symptoms of failure. No OBD2 codes.
chilone
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Re: Latest thoughts on e46?

Post by chilone »

I have a 2004 330xi 6 speed, that I bought in 2012 with 39,000 miles on it. It now has 170,000 and it has been a fantastic car. I've changed axles, center support bearing, control arm bushings and the fuel pump. I did the vanos, expansion tank and oil filter housing gasket as preventative maintenance. They were all fine. The interior is great (garaged), no rust and no leaks. It's my daily, it's powerful enough and it kicks ass in the snow. I doubt I'll ever get rid of it.
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