Would I Like an E28 M5?
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- Posts: 2046
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: Marquette, MI
Would I Like an E28 M5?
Interesting comments about the E28 M5 from the moderator of the E30 M3 SIG, as forwarded to me by the biggest BMW fan I personally know (who happens to not own an E28 ):
Query:
I've been offered a deal on a really clean E28 M5. All stock. Good service history, etc. The car is out of town and I have never driven a E28 M5. I've always admired the look of the car & think it might be a fun experience. Who has personal experience with this generation M5? Is it just too dated? I've been told that the driving experience feels much more antiquated than the M3s that we all know and love. The car would be just for fun -- I wouldn't have to rely on it.
Any advice?
Thanks
Response:
The E28 M5 is the only hot rod BMW ever built. By that I mean it has characteristics of the 60's muscle cars. The M6 could have fallen into the same category but its weight and geometry created a different outcome (and the M635CSi, ditto, with taller gearing).
The E28 M5 is a BMW whose chassis is not up to the task of the 300hp and torque curve. You can scare yourself (with glee) with an E28 M5 in a way that I've not had in any other BMW. The E30 M3 is underpowered (even in 2.5 Evo form) compared to its chassis/suspension capabilities.
As for ownership - reliable as anything. Typical E28 problems, mostly annoying and minor. Suspensions are often rebuilt with uprated parts, the rear self leveling has often been replaced. Brakes ... most people drive too much with their brakes (they are for stopping, not slowing down) and some folks do updates there. You're looking at a 20 year old car, so it pays to know what has been done. Many have had the front crank nut replaced with the Fahey part. Cooling systems have probably (?) been replaced. Ignition system parts can need replacement (coil tops decompose, plug wires). I've not seen the Motronics go bad. The rest is stupid stuff - window switches, head rest adjuster, blah blah.
Oh - find out history on exhaust. Mufflers are not cheap (factory stuff dies about every 10 years). Can't speak to the catalyst, but I'd want to know the exhaust condition.
Paint is single stage and while black, can be maintained. Best to keep it out of the sun (garage parking is a good thing. Rear tail lights can have issues in need to be cleaned (contacts) and water can enter the trunk if seal issues. Also, while on the back end of things, the bumper covers deteriorate. E28 M5's can often rust where the license plate lights mount - take a look under there.
As for the drivetrain I don't think Rosche ever designed anything skimpy. I would check that compression and
leakdown numbers are good - a rebuild will wipe more than half the car's value. Most of these cars are running either Jim Conforti's chip or Dinan's - Jim's was the
early install for folks, transforming the car into a rocket. Run good, high test gas, and listen for pinging.
I owned an E28 M5 for a while. It was stink fast. I recall driving an E34 M5 back to back and immediately making the hot rod distinction. The E28 M5 has little sound proofing (comparatively) and you can hear all the wonderful
mechanical noises.
Having said that ... using the car as a daily driver is a personal choice. If it's a nice car, hopefully you can keep it to the same level of condition through your ownership.
There were a few cars that were made with black interiors. If I recall the story was Canadian order, and a few US special orders (on the left coast, if memory serves). The rest are natural and most of the driver seats are worn fairly well,
especially for those of us driving without marathon runner bodies :-O
Query:
I've been offered a deal on a really clean E28 M5. All stock. Good service history, etc. The car is out of town and I have never driven a E28 M5. I've always admired the look of the car & think it might be a fun experience. Who has personal experience with this generation M5? Is it just too dated? I've been told that the driving experience feels much more antiquated than the M3s that we all know and love. The car would be just for fun -- I wouldn't have to rely on it.
Any advice?
Thanks
Response:
The E28 M5 is the only hot rod BMW ever built. By that I mean it has characteristics of the 60's muscle cars. The M6 could have fallen into the same category but its weight and geometry created a different outcome (and the M635CSi, ditto, with taller gearing).
The E28 M5 is a BMW whose chassis is not up to the task of the 300hp and torque curve. You can scare yourself (with glee) with an E28 M5 in a way that I've not had in any other BMW. The E30 M3 is underpowered (even in 2.5 Evo form) compared to its chassis/suspension capabilities.
As for ownership - reliable as anything. Typical E28 problems, mostly annoying and minor. Suspensions are often rebuilt with uprated parts, the rear self leveling has often been replaced. Brakes ... most people drive too much with their brakes (they are for stopping, not slowing down) and some folks do updates there. You're looking at a 20 year old car, so it pays to know what has been done. Many have had the front crank nut replaced with the Fahey part. Cooling systems have probably (?) been replaced. Ignition system parts can need replacement (coil tops decompose, plug wires). I've not seen the Motronics go bad. The rest is stupid stuff - window switches, head rest adjuster, blah blah.
Oh - find out history on exhaust. Mufflers are not cheap (factory stuff dies about every 10 years). Can't speak to the catalyst, but I'd want to know the exhaust condition.
Paint is single stage and while black, can be maintained. Best to keep it out of the sun (garage parking is a good thing. Rear tail lights can have issues in need to be cleaned (contacts) and water can enter the trunk if seal issues. Also, while on the back end of things, the bumper covers deteriorate. E28 M5's can often rust where the license plate lights mount - take a look under there.
As for the drivetrain I don't think Rosche ever designed anything skimpy. I would check that compression and
leakdown numbers are good - a rebuild will wipe more than half the car's value. Most of these cars are running either Jim Conforti's chip or Dinan's - Jim's was the
early install for folks, transforming the car into a rocket. Run good, high test gas, and listen for pinging.
I owned an E28 M5 for a while. It was stink fast. I recall driving an E34 M5 back to back and immediately making the hot rod distinction. The E28 M5 has little sound proofing (comparatively) and you can hear all the wonderful
mechanical noises.
Having said that ... using the car as a daily driver is a personal choice. If it's a nice car, hopefully you can keep it to the same level of condition through your ownership.
There were a few cars that were made with black interiors. If I recall the story was Canadian order, and a few US special orders (on the left coast, if memory serves). The rest are natural and most of the driver seats are worn fairly well,
especially for those of us driving without marathon runner bodies :-O
I'll agree it was a good response, but I don't think he really understands that there's not much difference between it and an M6. The weight is in different places, and the seating position is considerably different which changes the feel between the two, but it has nothing to do with the chassis' ability to handle power. It is a hooligan mobile when you want it, but I've never owned a better road car than the M5. He's right about the insulation bit though; having been through a late US M6 I can say it has stuffing and foam in places I didn't think possible compared to my M. If anything, the E39 M5 is the M family hot rod. Those cars are spectacular, stomping, tires on fire, sideways on demand, arrest machines. And I love them, too.
As much as I love and desire an E30 M3 as my ultimate expression of "M" (and I'd trade my M5 for one without a thought), most 'CCA M3 owners are convinced their car is the single greatest machine ever constructed by mankind, and that there can be none better. It's the same way that many here feel about the E28, really. So take it with a grain of salt. I love my M5, and consider myself lucky to have it. I'd also love an M6, but can't justify owning another limited production 80's coupe (yet). To me, the M5 is an inexplicably cheaper and more practical means of entry into the S38 club than a good M6, and from the drivers' seat they're close enough as makes no difference, plus I can get 4 doors past my wife .
As much as I love and desire an E30 M3 as my ultimate expression of "M" (and I'd trade my M5 for one without a thought), most 'CCA M3 owners are convinced their car is the single greatest machine ever constructed by mankind, and that there can be none better. It's the same way that many here feel about the E28, really. So take it with a grain of salt. I love my M5, and consider myself lucky to have it. I'd also love an M6, but can't justify owning another limited production 80's coupe (yet). To me, the M5 is an inexplicably cheaper and more practical means of entry into the S38 club than a good M6, and from the drivers' seat they're close enough as makes no difference, plus I can get 4 doors past my wife .
For those reading this response, Filippo Morelli is a long time BMW enthusiast and the founder of the E30 M3 Special Interest Group. I agree with his input and believe that his thoughts are accurate.
With regards to the suggestion above about the E24 chassis, it does yield some rigidity due to its coupe design when compared that of the E28.
Best,
RCBMW
With regards to the suggestion above about the E24 chassis, it does yield some rigidity due to its coupe design when compared that of the E28.
Best,
RCBMW
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- Posts: 47
- Joined: Sep 09, 2009 10:00 PM
This is old, but I thought it might fit in here.
Hey, so I bought one of these things a few weeks ago, I’ve been driving it around a little bit, dropping in the forums here and there and, along with my wife and my friends, asking myself “what the hell am I thinking with this old car?”
Because the BMW E28 M5 is a silly car. Perhaps it was superlative when it was new but now it is a machine that time has left behind. It has a motor that isn’t particularly strong, (our family grocery getter, an XC 90 has more ponies, as they like to say in the auto writing world) it doesn’t go very fast, a new Toyota Camry can keep up, it isn’t particularly well built or appointed (again see the Camry example), it is loud and it rides like a forklift.
Despite all this is seems to have acquired a small following, which now that I am part of, that might warrant some mention. And since I’ve been out shopping for one recently and in contact with a number of owners, I wonder if I’m in as good a position as anyone to comment on who owns these cars here in the summer of 2006. My biases are shaped by only being in touch with those who want to sell their cars and those who communicate on line; still I think a picture emerges.
First off, this is a car that is owned by men, and primarily men age 30 to 45. One can speculate as to why, I wonder if younger men, generally, don’t have enough money for a cash drain like this and older ones have lost the burn, are selling out and, quite possibility, have wised up. As for a women, you are as likely to find a women talking about the chassis serial number, valve clearances and rims on her M5 as find one stuffing dollar bills in the G-string of an exotic dancer or entering the freshmen class at MIT. There is negligible gender cross over this car because this is a mechanical car, a linier car, a hierarchical car in the extreme and so far as I can tell it is only men with their mechanical, linier and hierarchical minds who are interested.
So what men bite? The first general classification that appears to a buyer is the division between those who can afford the car and its upkeep and those who can’t. Since the cars trade hands for less than a new Hyundai, around 10K, a fair amount of them end up in the hands of people who aren’t ready for the upkeep bills. In the can afford category seem to be a lot of engineers and financial services types.
The financial services guys are the ones who put their cars on e-bay photographed next to pictures of their E60's or who, like the guy I bought mine from, meet you at the airport in a new E55 AMG and are wistfully having you help them clean out their garage. These guys, like most guys who make a living selling bonds, trading currency or shorting coal have their limitations. They seem to own the cars as conversation pieces, ego boosts or a way to be different, however, in the distraction that too-much-resources creates, I’m not sure how much traction the machines gain upon their imagination. The ones who I talk to seem to have a limited understanding of the cars and they seem to take a limited hold of them. A telling comment from the guy who sold it to me was “Last week I’d left the E55 home was driving the M5 when I got stuck in traffic. I got off the freeway and cut through the Oakland hills to get home. God that was great, I’d forgotten how much fun the car is to drive.” What didn’t occur to him is to leave the E55 home every day in order to the cut through the Oakland hills, instead he was selling it to me and showing the guys at the office how big the 2005 bonus was by what was in his parking space. Each to their own.
The engineers are in a different class. They know and understand the cars, they are the bedrocks of forums and thank God for them. Not a few of them seem to have traded in there Star Trek based obsession with which episode Kirk escaped Kingon armada with phasar enigmon 11 (or was it phaser enigmon 12) and debating weather Hulk could take The Thing in a fair fight with obsessing about the model numbers, build dates, and engine oil options. This is great, that’s why they are engineers they take wonderful care of the cars and thank God for them.
The second major category of owners, at least from the point of view of this buyer, is those who can’t afford the cars. They also break down into two categories. First are those who think it’s neat to have an old black BMW that goes fast but don’t know much else. You don’t find these people on the forums but bump into them as they try to sell. They are clueless, they are not sure what they own, their cars have become beaters and they are to be avoided by the buyer.
The last group of people who can barely afford their cars and are either looking to sell or are forgoing milk for the children in order to buy another quart of synthetic oil are the owners I like the most. They are the ones hanging in by will, grit and intelligence. They are all over these forums, thoughtful, restrained and quietly passionate. These are the men like the fellow who posted his experience changing out his timing chain. I bit my fingers as I read about how, after two days of trying, he finally got the dampner retaining nut off the shaft with a Dremal tool and nearly clapped when I read how after the job the car started up, the rattle came out of the chain as the tensioner kicked in the car has now gone 600 miles without a hitch. These guys are self-educated mechanics, resourceful and gutsy. They are the heirs to the men who staggered up the Plains of Abraham to attack the British garrison at Quebec, their grandfathers came off the farm, cursed Patton blue and kept the third Army’s tanks on line and barreling toward the Rhine. I’m proud to join them in this minor endeavor.
But why? As Paul DeWitt started to attempt to articulate but eventually broke off, why care at all about these 20 year-old boxy, out dated cars?
First of all, they’re better looking than you think they are. It’s obvious that their shape is in a different category than the ubiquitous, Chris Bangle inspired, rounded automobiles that the wind tunnels and friction coefficients have bent almost everything on four wheels into over the last 15 years. (Although there is starting to be a backlash, see the new Mustang and Charger). But different how? As far as I can tell the shape of the e28 emerged in the mid-seventies and its design language is rooted firmly in the Bauhaus where bold clear geometry was intended to convey strength and integrity. However the E28s save themselves from being Volvo 240s or Mercedes 300s by Marcello Gabrilini's brilliant slight swoop of the hood and that quirky, vaguely menacing backslash of the front grill. They are not quite graceful but not dull either and the tension between the box of the back end and the slant of the front is continually interesting.
Beyond looks there is balance. Again, the motor isn’t that big, the tires aren’t that wide, the car isn’t that quick, the interior is that lux, however, like good wine, skillful diplomacy or a healthy marriage, this endeavor keeps its elements in balance. In a distinctly West German way I find that the motor, suspension, brakes and driver environment work together in harmony in the e28 M5, something like the tannins, oak, alcohol and grape work together in well executed wine. Therefore every drive, like every sip is a potential joy. Every time I’m in the car, particularly after being in new cars in it’s class (there are no older ones) I’m struck by how well all the systems dance together, how tight the car feels and how even for me, a guy who has been living in Manhattan and hasn’t driven regularly for 8 years, the car is cleanly responsive to my instructions.
Finally there is great pleasure to be taken in the age of these cars. 20 years is a long, long time for a complex machine to run in harsh environment and anyone who has an old complex machine that is running well knows that only a magical mix of luck, and the focused labor or dozens of men working dozens hours has made the experience possible. Every experience in an old car is refracted through this luck and labor and is richer because of it.
I didn’t really know any of this a month ago when I decided to get the car, though I intuited that I wanted off the shinny new car trail in on something different, preferable made by tight-lipped West Germans, preferably with soul, preferably something my employees would walk past in the parking lot that would make them more curious than irate.
And so I found the car on-line, made sure it was what it was said it was, bought it and flew to San Francisco to pick it up and take it back East. I wasn’t quite sure what to make of it initially but got my first hint of the future a day later on I-80 coming East out of Sacramento across the floor of the Central Valley just before dawn.
There were just a few cars on a butter smooth road and the cruise control was set to 80 when some kid in a Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX came up weaving up traffic and ended up in front of me. He and the car in the right lane were running even at about ninety, no one in front of them. Hmmmm. I and put the M5 in the left lane crept up on that GSX in 5th gear until I was 10 feet off his bumper. Then I did what I like to think the white-coated, short-haired, bespeckled, clip-board carrying Hun who created my machine wanted me to do – I gave that GSX a long steady flash of my brights. GSX did just what I expected, he accelerated, moved over to the right hand lane and kept accelerating. I gave him a few seconds to declare himself and then I dropped into 4th and the 20 year old car pulled across 4500 to 6500 RPM, joyfully howling like a turbo jet, lunging forward until I put her in fifth and kept going until I was locked at 140 mph, the GSX disappearing in the rearview mirror as I hurled across the waking Central Valley into the riot of the coming sun.
Hey, so I bought one of these things a few weeks ago, I’ve been driving it around a little bit, dropping in the forums here and there and, along with my wife and my friends, asking myself “what the hell am I thinking with this old car?”
Because the BMW E28 M5 is a silly car. Perhaps it was superlative when it was new but now it is a machine that time has left behind. It has a motor that isn’t particularly strong, (our family grocery getter, an XC 90 has more ponies, as they like to say in the auto writing world) it doesn’t go very fast, a new Toyota Camry can keep up, it isn’t particularly well built or appointed (again see the Camry example), it is loud and it rides like a forklift.
Despite all this is seems to have acquired a small following, which now that I am part of, that might warrant some mention. And since I’ve been out shopping for one recently and in contact with a number of owners, I wonder if I’m in as good a position as anyone to comment on who owns these cars here in the summer of 2006. My biases are shaped by only being in touch with those who want to sell their cars and those who communicate on line; still I think a picture emerges.
First off, this is a car that is owned by men, and primarily men age 30 to 45. One can speculate as to why, I wonder if younger men, generally, don’t have enough money for a cash drain like this and older ones have lost the burn, are selling out and, quite possibility, have wised up. As for a women, you are as likely to find a women talking about the chassis serial number, valve clearances and rims on her M5 as find one stuffing dollar bills in the G-string of an exotic dancer or entering the freshmen class at MIT. There is negligible gender cross over this car because this is a mechanical car, a linier car, a hierarchical car in the extreme and so far as I can tell it is only men with their mechanical, linier and hierarchical minds who are interested.
So what men bite? The first general classification that appears to a buyer is the division between those who can afford the car and its upkeep and those who can’t. Since the cars trade hands for less than a new Hyundai, around 10K, a fair amount of them end up in the hands of people who aren’t ready for the upkeep bills. In the can afford category seem to be a lot of engineers and financial services types.
The financial services guys are the ones who put their cars on e-bay photographed next to pictures of their E60's or who, like the guy I bought mine from, meet you at the airport in a new E55 AMG and are wistfully having you help them clean out their garage. These guys, like most guys who make a living selling bonds, trading currency or shorting coal have their limitations. They seem to own the cars as conversation pieces, ego boosts or a way to be different, however, in the distraction that too-much-resources creates, I’m not sure how much traction the machines gain upon their imagination. The ones who I talk to seem to have a limited understanding of the cars and they seem to take a limited hold of them. A telling comment from the guy who sold it to me was “Last week I’d left the E55 home was driving the M5 when I got stuck in traffic. I got off the freeway and cut through the Oakland hills to get home. God that was great, I’d forgotten how much fun the car is to drive.” What didn’t occur to him is to leave the E55 home every day in order to the cut through the Oakland hills, instead he was selling it to me and showing the guys at the office how big the 2005 bonus was by what was in his parking space. Each to their own.
The engineers are in a different class. They know and understand the cars, they are the bedrocks of forums and thank God for them. Not a few of them seem to have traded in there Star Trek based obsession with which episode Kirk escaped Kingon armada with phasar enigmon 11 (or was it phaser enigmon 12) and debating weather Hulk could take The Thing in a fair fight with obsessing about the model numbers, build dates, and engine oil options. This is great, that’s why they are engineers they take wonderful care of the cars and thank God for them.
The second major category of owners, at least from the point of view of this buyer, is those who can’t afford the cars. They also break down into two categories. First are those who think it’s neat to have an old black BMW that goes fast but don’t know much else. You don’t find these people on the forums but bump into them as they try to sell. They are clueless, they are not sure what they own, their cars have become beaters and they are to be avoided by the buyer.
The last group of people who can barely afford their cars and are either looking to sell or are forgoing milk for the children in order to buy another quart of synthetic oil are the owners I like the most. They are the ones hanging in by will, grit and intelligence. They are all over these forums, thoughtful, restrained and quietly passionate. These are the men like the fellow who posted his experience changing out his timing chain. I bit my fingers as I read about how, after two days of trying, he finally got the dampner retaining nut off the shaft with a Dremal tool and nearly clapped when I read how after the job the car started up, the rattle came out of the chain as the tensioner kicked in the car has now gone 600 miles without a hitch. These guys are self-educated mechanics, resourceful and gutsy. They are the heirs to the men who staggered up the Plains of Abraham to attack the British garrison at Quebec, their grandfathers came off the farm, cursed Patton blue and kept the third Army’s tanks on line and barreling toward the Rhine. I’m proud to join them in this minor endeavor.
But why? As Paul DeWitt started to attempt to articulate but eventually broke off, why care at all about these 20 year-old boxy, out dated cars?
First of all, they’re better looking than you think they are. It’s obvious that their shape is in a different category than the ubiquitous, Chris Bangle inspired, rounded automobiles that the wind tunnels and friction coefficients have bent almost everything on four wheels into over the last 15 years. (Although there is starting to be a backlash, see the new Mustang and Charger). But different how? As far as I can tell the shape of the e28 emerged in the mid-seventies and its design language is rooted firmly in the Bauhaus where bold clear geometry was intended to convey strength and integrity. However the E28s save themselves from being Volvo 240s or Mercedes 300s by Marcello Gabrilini's brilliant slight swoop of the hood and that quirky, vaguely menacing backslash of the front grill. They are not quite graceful but not dull either and the tension between the box of the back end and the slant of the front is continually interesting.
Beyond looks there is balance. Again, the motor isn’t that big, the tires aren’t that wide, the car isn’t that quick, the interior is that lux, however, like good wine, skillful diplomacy or a healthy marriage, this endeavor keeps its elements in balance. In a distinctly West German way I find that the motor, suspension, brakes and driver environment work together in harmony in the e28 M5, something like the tannins, oak, alcohol and grape work together in well executed wine. Therefore every drive, like every sip is a potential joy. Every time I’m in the car, particularly after being in new cars in it’s class (there are no older ones) I’m struck by how well all the systems dance together, how tight the car feels and how even for me, a guy who has been living in Manhattan and hasn’t driven regularly for 8 years, the car is cleanly responsive to my instructions.
Finally there is great pleasure to be taken in the age of these cars. 20 years is a long, long time for a complex machine to run in harsh environment and anyone who has an old complex machine that is running well knows that only a magical mix of luck, and the focused labor or dozens of men working dozens hours has made the experience possible. Every experience in an old car is refracted through this luck and labor and is richer because of it.
I didn’t really know any of this a month ago when I decided to get the car, though I intuited that I wanted off the shinny new car trail in on something different, preferable made by tight-lipped West Germans, preferably with soul, preferably something my employees would walk past in the parking lot that would make them more curious than irate.
And so I found the car on-line, made sure it was what it was said it was, bought it and flew to San Francisco to pick it up and take it back East. I wasn’t quite sure what to make of it initially but got my first hint of the future a day later on I-80 coming East out of Sacramento across the floor of the Central Valley just before dawn.
There were just a few cars on a butter smooth road and the cruise control was set to 80 when some kid in a Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX came up weaving up traffic and ended up in front of me. He and the car in the right lane were running even at about ninety, no one in front of them. Hmmmm. I and put the M5 in the left lane crept up on that GSX in 5th gear until I was 10 feet off his bumper. Then I did what I like to think the white-coated, short-haired, bespeckled, clip-board carrying Hun who created my machine wanted me to do – I gave that GSX a long steady flash of my brights. GSX did just what I expected, he accelerated, moved over to the right hand lane and kept accelerating. I gave him a few seconds to declare himself and then I dropped into 4th and the 20 year old car pulled across 4500 to 6500 RPM, joyfully howling like a turbo jet, lunging forward until I put her in fifth and kept going until I was locked at 140 mph, the GSX disappearing in the rearview mirror as I hurled across the waking Central Valley into the riot of the coming sun.
Prizefighter, that was great, and an accurate summary of the M5 ownership experience. I'm sure a V6 Camry is faster to 60, but it sure as hell doesn't pull to redline and make glorious noises like an S38 does
moving on...
moving on...
That's a good point. I'm no automotive structural engineer, but E24's have massive, heavy, long, frameless doors and thin pillars compared to the E28 so I doubt there's much between them as far as body stiffness. I've spent countless hours adjusting door hinges and strikers on multiple E24's just to get them to shut correctly and compensate for chassis sag on original, no accident cars, and I've never once had to adjust the doors on an E28. Basic stuff, but a good representation of a chassis' integrity.rcbmw wrote: With regards to the suggestion above about the E24 chassis, it does yield some rigidity due to its coupe design when compared that of the E28.
Best,
RCBMW
Prizefighter, that was some discertation! I'm almost 60 and I have owned at least a dozen BMW's.
The older ones to me seem better built. I have saved a ton of money not having any car notes. And the pleasure of driving one of the M series is nothing to be compared that I know of. Having had a number of Mustangs that have all but a few been stolen is no comparison to these cars. I picked up a E28 M5 this Sept, and have been working on it to get her ready for the spring. I own aE30 M3 and a '87 535is, my daily driver with 197k miles! Every other week, I have to drive my M3 for personal enjoyment & satisfaction. When I get the M5 finished, I'll probably sell the 535 and get a E30 325is. I haven't driven anything as well built and so much fun as these machines.
The older ones to me seem better built. I have saved a ton of money not having any car notes. And the pleasure of driving one of the M series is nothing to be compared that I know of. Having had a number of Mustangs that have all but a few been stolen is no comparison to these cars. I picked up a E28 M5 this Sept, and have been working on it to get her ready for the spring. I own aE30 M3 and a '87 535is, my daily driver with 197k miles! Every other week, I have to drive my M3 for personal enjoyment & satisfaction. When I get the M5 finished, I'll probably sell the 535 and get a E30 325is. I haven't driven anything as well built and so much fun as these machines.
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- Location: Fort Fun Colorado
I woke up early this morning to do a bit of wrenching on my M5 before heading off to work. I have the plenum off to replace an oil pressure sender and have a good look at the driver's side of the engine bay and those gorgeous throttle bodies. The new sender has been screwed into the adapter, some electrical connections cleaned, a few vacuum hoses replaced, and all the visible hose clamps checked for snugness. I love the tinkering on this old car, it's a source of pride to keep my car running as it should.
Now it's time to button her back up so that she'll be ready for a drive this weekend. Dropped a washer through the engine bay and to the ground. Looked under the car and there was a new wet spot on the garage floor! Frustration welled up, "Why do I own old cars? It's just one thing after another!" (I also have an '85 VW Westy that I'm in the middle of rebuilding the front suspension and steering)
Then I read Prizefighter's post this morning. Thank you, thank you, thank you for that! Perspective is everything and I have mine back now.
Andy
Now it's time to button her back up so that she'll be ready for a drive this weekend. Dropped a washer through the engine bay and to the ground. Looked under the car and there was a new wet spot on the garage floor! Frustration welled up, "Why do I own old cars? It's just one thing after another!" (I also have an '85 VW Westy that I'm in the middle of rebuilding the front suspension and steering)
Then I read Prizefighter's post this morning. Thank you, thank you, thank you for that! Perspective is everything and I have mine back now.
Andy
Much better written than any summary I could write. Here's mine anyway:
- The car only attracts enthusiasts; owners or attention, they're enthusiasts. Sure you might get someone whose impressed by the badge, but they don't know anything about the car. Leading to:
- It's a sleeper. You won't get much attention when driving at lower revs. A lot of people don't even know what an M5 is, let alone that they made one in the 80s and that it will run with or beat their sporty car that's 20 years newer.
- Driving is exciting. You can feel things, be it through the suspension, steering wheel, throttle, brake, clutch or shift knob. The engine sounds like its racing origins. The car handles well, you don't have traction control but you don't need it because its easily controllable and predictable.
- You can take a group of people for a ride that isn't too loud even by today's standards.
-It's exclusive. Not only did they not make very many, but they are relatively expensive to fix (minus the relatively if you don't do your own labor). Unless you live in one of a handful of places in the country (I pulled into a repair shop in Seattle once and saw two others sitting in the lot), you're going to be the only one around who has one.
- The car only attracts enthusiasts; owners or attention, they're enthusiasts. Sure you might get someone whose impressed by the badge, but they don't know anything about the car. Leading to:
- It's a sleeper. You won't get much attention when driving at lower revs. A lot of people don't even know what an M5 is, let alone that they made one in the 80s and that it will run with or beat their sporty car that's 20 years newer.
- Driving is exciting. You can feel things, be it through the suspension, steering wheel, throttle, brake, clutch or shift knob. The engine sounds like its racing origins. The car handles well, you don't have traction control but you don't need it because its easily controllable and predictable.
- You can take a group of people for a ride that isn't too loud even by today's standards.
-It's exclusive. Not only did they not make very many, but they are relatively expensive to fix (minus the relatively if you don't do your own labor). Unless you live in one of a handful of places in the country (I pulled into a repair shop in Seattle once and saw two others sitting in the lot), you're going to be the only one around who has one.
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my wife
I hope my wife never meets prizefighter as I'll be without a wonderful women.BRRV wrote:Wow. I love writing like that. Thank you.
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post topic
I must admit to this; I enjoyed prizefighters contribution to
this thread to the extent that I made a copy of it and placed
it in the glovebox . If ever I should entertain the thought of
parting with this vehicle this side of the grave, I'll use it to
refresh my memory.
this thread to the extent that I made a copy of it and placed
it in the glovebox . If ever I should entertain the thought of
parting with this vehicle this side of the grave, I'll use it to
refresh my memory.
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- Location: Seattle, WA
Well put
Prizefighter, I especially like the point above, but the whole piece was great. Exactly how I feel about my E28, even though it's "only" a 535i. Still beats anything else I've driven ever...except a couple e28 M5 test drives, of course.the shape of the e28 emerged in the mid-seventies and its design language is rooted firmly in the Bauhaus where bold clear geometry was intended to convey strength and integrity...the tension between the box of the back end and the slant of the front is continually interesting.
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Re: Well put
i second this opinion.welcometoalville wrote:Prizefighter, I especially like the point above, but the whole piece was great. Exactly how I feel about my E28, even though it's "only" a 535i. Still beats anything else I've driven ever...except a couple e28 M5 test drives, of course.the shape of the e28 emerged in the mid-seventies and its design language is rooted firmly in the Bauhaus where bold clear geometry was intended to convey strength and integrity...the tension between the box of the back end and the slant of the front is continually interesting.
No matter how old my 535i gets, it gets looks and stares everywhere it goes.
I bought it in Orlando and drove it back to Long Island. Some great reliability.
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re:PRIZEFIGHTER..............central valley..... BRILLIANT..
This "prizefighter" person, I like your style... I have been on that same stretch of road one to many times , running down the "dreaded", 99 between Sacktown to Visalia , and then Bake-O field..while ever pressing further up and down the GRAPEVINE to get back home to San DAGO.....That road SUCKS....... your story took me back ,but in a good way , being that I had just recently purchased a 5-series, That is in very good condition all around..I'm enjoying the car completely ...And now with reading of your RICE SLED hostile takeover,, {BRILLIANT WRITING BY THE WAY }, even furthers my expectations of my newly acquired "family 4 door" .... cheers... and please write more about the rest of your cross country journey .....